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Loading ...Neff: The dangerous ex-gay movement
I’m the first to admit that I need people to show me the way.
I’m accepting of help in household duties, because I’m not too handy with repairs, and only capable in the kitchen.
I’m eager to read responses to my columns because I cannot learn, I cannot grow, if I don’t get out of my head and swim around in someone else’s mind.And really, a big part of a reporter’s job is following people as they show the way through complex, unfamiliar, and, on the best but rarest of assignments, dangerous territory.
I admit I need help, direction, and instruction — the way shown, from time to time.
But I don’t need anyone showing me the way out of homosexuality. Thank you, no, preachers Lou Engle and Michael Brown. Thank you, no, Exodus International.
They say god has a better way than the way I live my life. And I say, what do they know about the way I live my life?
I live true to my partner, with honor for my parents, care for family and friends and compassion for others. I love, and I am loved.
They want to show me the way out of love to what? Show me the way to lying about my true self, to denying my true self, and, along the way, hurting others?
Exodus International recently concluded its International Freedom Conference in Wheaton, Ill. The event was billed as “the largest gathering in the world for those struggling with or impacted by homosexuality,” with ExodusMen and Women’s Oasis forums, an xScape program for youth and a Steadfast program for heterosexual married couples.
Workshops took place exploring “what happens in the heart of a woman that leads her down the path of lesbianism,” “what to do with unwanted sexual attractions and how to become pure again,” the blessing and opportunity of gender roles as biblically defined and, “finding our home in Jesus, rather than other women.”
There’s much to lampoon here, were ex-gay therapy not so serious, were ex-gay therapy advocates not telling a wider and young audience through Twitter, Facebook, MySpace and YouTube that heterosexuality is “God’s creative intent for humanity.”
“We are excited about the unprecedented access these opportunities provide and are hoping many will respond to a message that reflects God’s truth as well as his heart for those who struggle with questions about their sexuality,” Exodus youth outreach coordinator Scott Davis said in a news release announcing the organization’s social networking adventures.
There’s much to lampoon here, were ex-gay therapy not so dangerous, destroying spirit and family, and promoting stereotypes that gays and lesbians are damaged, wounded people using sex as a “pain-killer.”
New information from writer Thomas Maier suggests that one of the major studies cited to support of ex-gay therapy was falsified.
Maier, in the book “Masters of Sex” and in an article in Scientific American, raises serious questions about the validity of a study by William Masters and Virginia Johnson.
In “Homosexuality in Perspective” in 1979, Masters and Johnson claimed to have “converted” more than 70 percent of women and men struggling with homosexuality.
Staffers at the Masters and Johnson clinic from 1969 to 1977, the research period for which the 70 percent “conversion rate” was made, say then never met any of the converts, the ex-gays.
One team at the clinic maintains they never treated gays, and heard virtually nothing about ex-gay therapy.
Masters, according to Maier, refused to show one associate any files or share tape recordings on alleged conversions, and even Masters’ colleague, Johnson, is on the record as saying, “Bill was being creative in those days.”
“Creative” becomes a soft word for reckless.
And this study showed ex-gay advocates the way?
Like Drewski, I grew up in an area dominated by these types of religious fundamentalists. Even in terms of race, I have seen otherwise good people engage in or tolerate vile behavior because their church was somehow involved, even if peripherally.
People not familiar with these groups vastly underestimate their perspective on proselytizing. They generally believe most people, even most other Christians, are bound for Hell because of wrong beliefs and sinful actions. To compare them to someone trying to save a drowning man doesn’t even get to the point. Because a drowning man only dies once. They truly believe Hell is forever. And that unless you follow their relatively narrow (sometimes extremely narrow) doctrine exactly, that is your fate.
Which leads to the next problem when talking with them. It’s not that they are confused, or stupid, or illogical, or uneducated. Many of these fundamentalists are shockingly bright and educated (don’t let your prejudices mislead you). It’s that they fear for their own soul as well. The world is a place of temptation and if they fall off this narrow path, they will be bound for Hell as well. The harder you press, the more they feel they fighting to preserve their own fate.
It’s hard enough to debate rationally without becoming defensive and admit defeat. What if admitting defeat put you in fear for your soul? What if disagreeing with your church (/preacher) on any topic automatically meant that you were lost and needed saving? How open would you be to discussion?
Before the harpies jump in with the knee-jerk refrains on the evils of religion, these people completely have the right to live their lives this way. They have the right to raise their children this way (within certain established guidelines, eg children can’t be exposed to snake-handling or drinking poison). And they have the right to try to convince others to live this way. (As was noted on here recently, one thing they don’t understand is that we generally don’t believe that people can be “recruited.”)
Even though their right to swing their fists end where our noses begin, it will not be them (at least as a group) that decides to find a way to live with us. At the risk of sounding patronizing, as the more rational group, it is up to us to develop means to deal with them.
I agree that we should primarily ignore them while trying to limit any public harm they do. I believe that before long the ex-gay movement will simply be a fringe group like the Klan (itself a Christian organization). At the same time, when people show up in our midst scared because they fear their nature might be leading them to Hell, we have to be prepared to offer them more than just, “religion is mythology.” Can you see how that could easily only scare someone more?
Is there an org for ex-ex-gays? The ones that I have meet personally only found peace by contacting a local MCC or Unitarian Universalist Church (with UU often being more liberal than these people are accustomed to). But what about all those people who don’t have such groups near them?
Netjack–you get it. Fundamentalist Protestants (Baptists, Church of Christ, nondenominational charismatics, among others) believe they have a mandate from their god to proselytize, to spread their faith. They believe that the expansionist goals of their religion trump any and all civil laws. (I grew up in Tennessee, which like many states is infested with this crap.) Lies, deceptions and half-truths are part of spreading the faith and are therefore not only acceptable, but are endorsed and encouraged by god on high. There is no honest discourse with these people, no scrutiny of their doctrine or roots of their beliefs, because they’ll insist that their faith is as god wants it. In that sense, they’re the same as “modern” Muslims who insist the Qu’ran was given to humans by Allah in perfect form, and the Qu’ran is therefore unalterable by humans.
Was there any state or federal money given to support the Masters and Johnson clinic, or any specific work they did? If so, it may be possible to force release of documents with a FOI request.
As I have said before, the way I see it, there are only three kinds of anti-gay people:
(1) Ignorant people
(2) Self loathing homosexuals, and
(3) Those who exploit the first two.
Those in the so-called ex-gay movement are likely divided between categories 2 and 3.
If you haven’t seen “But I’m a Cheerleader” (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0179116/), that is a must see.
I don’t care what their belief is, and they can argue it all they want and think otherwise, but I’m 99% sure they’re pretty darn wrong.
Now you might say I’m a bit narrow-minded with that, but I’m usually a really open person, but only to a point. Guilt-tripping children into attending ex-gay gatherings is not something I am open to. I shudder to think how much damage has been done.
You’re almost right, Judderwocky. But their belief about who is and who is not innocent doesn’t actually stem from how long the person has been “infected” (though, there is a high correlation). It’s actually whether or not they believe that person is actually attempting to rid themselves of the perceived evil or not. Once someone has fully accepted what those people perceive as evil, of course those people don’t believe that person is safe. The key is to show those people, and especially others, that their perception is wrong.
Jerry, I didn’t mean to imply that anyone should accept what they are teaching. By a loving tone what I was trying to say is that when speaking about them, or to them, it is extremely counter productive to take an angry tone. It comes off as ignorant, possibly even crazy. Neither of which accomplish anything positive. Also, I meant that what I had said about their beliefs wasn’t false, not that their beliefs were somehow true, accurate, or in any way a positive thing. I apologize for the confusion.
Kelson, they have no right to demand that everyone live by their beliefs. Especially not in the US. However, a very central part of their belief includes a mandate to attempt to “save” as many others as possible. Because of this, they are willing to ignore other people’s rights in an attempt to act on at least part of what they believe.
Alcoholics and drug addicts just remove the temptation from them and get counseling. It doesn’t stop them from being alcoholics or drug addicts, removing the temptation of same sex sexual encounters does not make one an ex-gay! It is called at the very least a recovering homosexual or lesbian. What these people are failing to understand is that being gay is not JUST a sex act, but the way you feel. Feelings are hard to change, and still, if successful, they will still be recovering homosexuals/lesbians.
I’m sorry Netjack, but after getting a degree in theology, and actually having been to conversion therapy I must state that I believe you are absolutely wrong. They believe a person is “innocent” only at the outset. The longer a person remains in the lifestyle the more likely they are to view that person as a hazard to other individuals… particularly children. If they believe it is of “demonic” origin, they usually also believe that Children are more susceptible to these demonic forces and should be kept away from gay people. My family had a policy of not letting gay people around children because they were worried that they would molest them or infect them with their demons. They DO NOT believe we are innocent. I would encourage you to actually research what you are saying. These statements go back to teachings from the middle ages in which it was said that “a single sodomite could bring destruction upon a whole city.” They don’t believe we are innocent or any more safe than a serial killer. I agree that you are not going to win the debate with these people. They usually believe the earth is six thousand years old, that most of the animals at one time floated around on Noah’s yacht, and various other absurdities. If they believe in a book full of contradictions, you are never going to win an argument by pointing out theirs.
As a clarification…
When I say “ignore them,” I don’t mean that we shouldn’t defend ourselves or do what we can to protect gay kids (for example, keep the ex gay movement out of schools). What I mean is that we should give up trying to debate them.
We can take our case directly to those on the Left and in the Middle without getting into shrill shouting matches with these people.
> I know, it’s ridiculous, but that doesn’t make it false.
In the same way that one can’t say that a religion is “false” compared to a “true” religion, the Ex Gay Movement’s beliefs are indeed true. In that the movement has no empirical evidence to back up *any* of its claims–big or small, it’s most certainly is false. Science is on our side.
>In order to both undermine their argument, and have any chance of them even remotely listening to you, the pro-gay refrain needs to adopt a loving, inclusive tone.
No we don’t.
I have a better idea. I agree with you in that screeching at them will not accomplish anything. From that point, I’d say that we should ignore them, in that the people who are really into this stuff are plummeting in number. From a numbers/political perspective, they are next to meaningless.
So, live your life openly and let the “good people in the middle of the political spectrum” get to know us as we really are. Meanwhile, ignore the ex-gay movement. And, in time, the people on the left and in the middle–in other words, “the majority”–will come to know us, love us for who we really are, and understand that there’s no need to convert us. Consequently, the ex-gay movement gets increasingly marginalized. And we win without ever having to confront them aggressively.
They are irrelevant. Treat them as such, and save the effort for people who are willing to listen to get to know us.
Everything these evil people do and say is based upon that mythical book called the Bible. If they want to believe that horror story, fine. But what right do they have to demand that everyone else must live by this fiction. Isn’t this what the Islamic Taliban does? These sick people know nothing about us, how we live or love. Their ONLY focus is on what we do in bed, NOTHING ELSE. It would seem that this would qualify them for membership in the sexual sickness ward of a mental hospital. Unfortunately there are those of us who claim that their god and their Jesus doesn’t exist. Both are corruptions of many centuries of mythical stories glued together over time. Don’t get me wrong, I do believe there is a God, but not the joke that is described in their book of ignorance.
I wonder how many Christian have any knowledge about how their Bible was put together. I would suspect not many. Their simplistic answer is usually “oh, it was under the guidance of the Holy Spirit.” Oh yeah? Says who? Jim Jones claims to also have been under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. Most fanatics claim to be under the guidance of this Holy Spirit. I think it is just gas.
Ignorance can be fixed, but Stupid is forever.
It seems these people just like making things up as they go along trying to destroy the spirit and humanity of the individual. Just to bring them into their flock and help pay their bills. And don’t forget, they are tax exempt to boot! Imagine what we could do if just they started paying taxes on all activities other than charity.
They make up stories of how our lives are and that is why they want to fight the Pride Parades and people being out. Being out shows the world that we are not anything like what they claim us to be. We become a thorn in their sides, as opposed to the thorn in their Gods head.
May the Gods Bless Those Who Learn and Grow! Blessed Be!
Good article! We need more re this “ex-gay” thing!
I’m so sick and tired of people like Peter La Barbera, “Americans for truth about Homosexuality” constantly harping on about people who have “left” this dangerous, destructive, and sinful lifestyle.
“Ex-gay” I don’t think so!!
I’m certain you’ll hate me, which is funny as I agree that the “conversion” of gays is probably one of the most harmful things you could do to them. However, I’ve noticed a troubling refrain in all conversations about this: neither side even remotely understands the other.
As you clearly understand your side, let me try to explain theirs. As insane as it sounds, they firmly believe that homosexuality is something outside people that has been forced onto them. There are two ways they believe this has been forced on them: culture, and or demons (or other mystic mumbo jumbo). Those siding with culture attempt to use psychology to “defend” the innocent person they believe has been corrupted. Those siding with mystic/demonic reasons attempt to use mysticism. The important thing, though, is to realize that they all firmly believe they are defending an innocent in the same way you would do all you could to defend a child from a molester. I know, it’s ridiculous, but that doesn’t make it false.
Why is any of that important? Because no amount of anger, defensive behavior, or attacks will ever convince them they are wrong. Indeed, it lends strength to their arguments in the eyes of those ignorant to both sides. And that is certainly the last thing you want.
In order to both undermine their argument, and have any chance of them even remotely listening to you, the pro-gay refrain needs to adopt a loving, inclusive tone. I know you’re enraged, but lashing out only deepens the divide. In order to be accepted by society, society needs to see that you aren’t a threat, that you are, in fact, a wonderful addition – something worthy of its love. Since you are worthy, its just appearances you’ve got to work on.
It seems to me that these poor souls who seek a way out from being gay have been abused by guilt in the worst sort of way. These gay people have been browbeaten by pathetic, psycho, religious fanatics. It is very sad for them that they do not have a gay mentor to help them out instead of being brainwashed by these already brainwashed so-called christians.