Comments on: Besen: The Conservative implosion

By: Steve Krantz

Steve Krantz — Thu, 14 May 2009 17:22:18 +0000

Wayne – wonderful thoughts, giving me cheer today. With enemies like these, we can’t lose. Let’s hope that CA Supremes heed the recent trends and strike down Prop 8.

By: Victor J Kinzer

Victor J Kinzer — Thu, 14 May 2009 14:50:36 +0000

Ok, so you are totally correct, and it scares me silly. I’m all for this from the gay rights standpoint. Woo Hoo and yay for that. I am not a 1 issue voter though. I base my voting on the basic premise that no one can be trusted with too much power. I like a government with split power between people of differing political views, and preferably the people with the edge in the government are anti big business so there is a check against corporate America. So right now we kind of have the check against corporate America, at least more so than when Bush was in office. I am kind of terrified that we don’t have a good solid opposition party. I really really want to see the Republicans get someone like Ms. McCain (can’t remember her first name right now) as their new leaders. She is about people being about to live their lives how they want, but she is also about small government and fiscal accountability and all the other things the Republicans are supposed to stand for. I want universal health care, and social security reform, but I want a fiscal conservative standing next to the liberal making sure they are going to actually pay for it and not borrow us into oblivion. That is where the sweet spot is for government, and instead of moving towards the center after Bush we blew way past the sweet spot and are just a different extreme. I want my equilibrium, and no one is offering it right now.

By: Keith

Keith — Thu, 14 May 2009 13:42:27 +0000

This is not an unexpected development. What we are witnessing is just the natural culmination of the anti-gay agenda. When the majority of the country was blissfully ignorant of the LGBT members of their family and community, it was easy to get them to believe that we were child molesters, dirty predators, and operated on the fringes of society. Of course, the irony was lost of them that the reason we were on the fringes of society was because that’s where they wanted to keep us.

As more of us came out and became vocal advocates for equality, they had to move their message more toward the assertion that we spread disease and had to be controlled for the sake of the country.

Once we began asking for equal treatment in such mainstream areas as marriage and military service, they had to escalate their rhetoric to claim that we were a threat to civilization.

Thinking people have begun to recognize the silliness of the anti-gay activists’ claims, in part because they know LGBT people and do not fear us, and in part because the claims become more and more shrill and goofy as prior claims just don’t get the traction they once did.

Still, there are people out there who have bought into the anti-gay message so thoroughly (mainly because they are easily led, since they don’t think for themselves), that they will probably never see the light. Their numbers are diminishing rapidly, though.

In my opinion, this shows that we have already won the war. There may still be skirmishes left ahead, some of which we may even lose, but we have largely been successful in showing these people for what they truly are: bigots.

By: Tina

Tina — Thu, 14 May 2009 13:40:56 +0000

Anti-gay activists stumbled in their torch passing?

I think their torch fell apart.

Their old arguments based on fear, ignorance and prejudice have been exposed to the facts. And, the next generation has been exposed to actual GLBT people, and have seen the light.

There just isn’t much of a torch left for the next generation of Anti-Gay folk.

By: James M. Martin

James M. Martin — Thu, 14 May 2009 12:46:26 +0000

I wouldn’t count the conserves out just yet; down, yes, but out, no. So long as they have people like Tony (the PAC man, not the actor) Perkins funding anti-gay marriage initiatives in places like California, employing absurd claims that, e.g., gay marriage will lead to bestiality (in other words, playing the Fear Card), they will continue to do damage to the gay rights movement. Where is Rosie now that we need her? She, at least, has done battle with The Donald, and he, more than anyone, has propped up Prejean by demeaning the movement when he refused to take her Miss California crown away from her. Now she serves two masters, both despotic.

By: Jere

Jere — Thu, 14 May 2009 12:20:33 +0000

“pohaku Said: So we need to take the battle to THEIR camp. Attack, not defend, with the following talking points that all should be saying. They always question us, as to why we should be allowed to marry. Maybe we should ask them these questions…” so, if you believe the only marriage is between a man and a woman, because God said it is, you obviously would support a law banning divorce, right? How can a vow made to God be nullified by the state? make them answer this.”

I agree with you on this. ALWAYS turn an argument back on them and then watch them squirm. My husband and I have our tee-shirts for GayDays at Disney and they say “Don’t worry. My gay marriage won’t affect your straight divorce.” LOL

By: drewski

drewski — Thu, 14 May 2009 11:40:35 +0000

@ Peter–Take a look at what the GOP did with 16 years of control in Ohio and you can see why I don’t vote for them. The point of the comment was straightforward–there are many (more) gays who would vote Republican (than already do) if the GOP would just junk its antigay fixation.

There are elected Republicans who have voted for us. What’s wrong with that? Your mistrust might be as deep as mine, but you gotta admit that having Republicans vote FOR gay issues means the Dems in that vote have no cover. I like that. And isn’t that really our goal–to have our rights recognized to the point that we have choice in elections, that we don’t always vote for Dems out of fear?

By: Kari

Kari — Thu, 14 May 2009 11:28:25 +0000

Besen: Your post made me realize something. We talk far more about our opponents than we talk about ourselves.

Among gay activists, names like Fred Phelps, James Dobson, etc. are widely-known; more widely-known than they would be in the general population.

But I can’t for the life of me think who the head of the HRC is. Or the Empire Pride Agenda. Or Garden State Equality. Or the NCLR. Or GLAAD. Or… well, any gay rights organization.

Why is that?

By: KaninZ

KaninZ — Thu, 14 May 2009 10:00:17 +0000

The GOP’s answer on how to move forward after the massacre? “Crank up the crazy another notch or two!”

It’s highly entertaining to watch the circular firing squad that the Repugs have become.

Watch that Cheney…he’ll go for the face!

By: Gimme A Ciggie

Gimme A Ciggie — Thu, 14 May 2009 05:37:03 +0000

Im tired of Christian/Repubs/RightWing/MormonChurch and other American Looney Binz WHAT I CAN AND CANNOT DO! what the hex? Where has America gone? Ill tell you where its gone! TO CHRISTIAN HELL!
Whats REALLY going on, and listen closely and tell a friend…
Christianity in America is dying. A recent study I was reading said that a huge percent of Americans Claim “Spiritual” instead of affiliated with any RELIGIOUS group, and Christians know this, that is why they are doing anything in their power even if its playing dirty, to keep their bloody knuckles clinched on society and law, unfortunatley theyre going to lose..more like they are the huge car crash on “Final Destination 2″ I want to say to all gays who read this, Whatever you do, DO NOT let Christianity or any repressing “religion” turn you off from spirituality. Religion is for people who cant think for themselves, spirituality is recognizing your inner divinity(the spirit that makes humans not just animals)and realizing the higher divinity ruling the life force of the universe… Do not become an athiest because of these radical heiffers, athiesm makes you no different from them, heartless, souless, and only concerned with material and mundane affairs which eventually blacken their hearts to a point where they are harming others. Knowing with your heart whats good and whats truley bad is simple spirituality the rest is what your life path brings to you.