Tot he religious marriage argumentors: I didn’t read the whole thread but believe this comment will help. Marriage IS a civil contract, but to win, we must at times put ourselves in “their” shoes.

Nearly everyone who has been married in this country was married by a RELIGIOUS representative; a priest, priestess or whatever those cultists call their leaders.

In England you have a civil marriage, performed by a representative of government, and then a religious ceremony if you choose (in my opinion, if you choose to have your marriage soiled by the evils of religion).

People here that defend “traditional” marriage are ill-informed on this issue and ignorant in general…but my point is, they don’t see “civil marriage” in their community. They don’t go to weddings at city hall, they go to the church. They connect marriage with the church and then believe the lies that say their church will be forced to marry us.

It is deceptive, but it is what they here and these people believe ANYTHING. Snakes talk in their world!

So, no, let’s not change the name, let’s simply change the way our government weilds its civil authority to marry people. Simply cancel the contract between religion and state that grants the religions the power to place people into the marriage contract.

I’ve heard so many people argue for civil contracts and leave marriage to the churches. this is conceding! Take marriage FROM the churches, force everyone to go to a justice of the peace, not a priest (because we don’t let priests become justices of the peace) and then choose where to celebrate the union…at home, at a restaurant or sadly, at a church.

this is OUR civic institution. The state grants its power to marry to religious institutions out of expediency. If we stop that, we stop the religious cries of abomination, as they won’t be in the marriage business at all.

And we don’t concede the word marriage. that is a hard line I will not cross. Religion doesn’t own that word.

Umm . . what exactly am I supposed to be insisting about religious marriage? Didn’t I just say that I couldn’t care less if some sort of god or goddess “sanctifies” my marriage?

Now if you mean that I insist on pointing out the existence of marriage in the eyes of religious organizations, then yes I do insists on pointing out that such a thing EXISTS. Would you rather I stick my head in the sand and ignore socio-cultural realities?

A couple of items of interest especially for those who live in CA:

The Courage Campaign is asking people to sign a pledge “to support our campaign to repeal Prop 8 and restore marriage equality to California.”

http://www.couragecampaign.org/page/s/repealprop8

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http://www.ucc.org/news/californias-prop-8-passage.html – California’s Prop 8 passage prompts UCC ad

“The United Church of Christ’s Cleveland-based national office has purchased full-page ads in three of California’s largest gay community publications after voters there approved a constitutional amendment, known as Proposition 8, that halts same-gender marriages in the state.”

Jake said: “I don’t know why some people simply started bitching about Obama on this thread…”

You must be new to reading the comments on this site. Almost everybody else here has known for several weeks who the Obama-bashing, pro-Republican “some people” is. Welcome to “Wayne’s Planet.”

Wayne says: How can you say he advocates marriage equality when he won’t even call it a Marriage?

I believe I’ve already pointed out the explicit statements of the Obama platform. Would you like me to post the entire analysis again? I’m not sure if you understood the difference between a union recognized by the state and one recognized by the church. One has legal ramifications, the other does and should not.

Now, I’m not saying that gay marriage is going to be first and foremost of his initiatives after he’s sworn in, all I’m doing is pointing out what’s been explicitly said by him or his people. Do I believe what I’m explicitly told by politicians? Well . . not fully, I guess, but what other choice do I have? If I thought that EVERY SINGLE WORD from a politician’s mouth was a lie I think I’d become a hermit.

Wayne says: No, I have no doubts that Obama will NOT do anything to further gay rights in any substantial way.

See, unlike you, I’m not going to make such bold predictions about what he will or will not do, especially predictions that go against what he’s explicitly said.

Given that he’s not even been sworn into office yet, I think the fact that he’s banned discrimination based on sexual orientation and gender expression shows that he’s keeping a pretty clean house.

So I’d say that he’s ALREADY making strides in what ways he can. Contrary to your prediction, he’s already making effort, without even the power of the presidency behind him.

Unless you’re going to advocate removing him as President, take your blinders off and open your mind. I’m not asking you to fall in love with him, I’m just asking you to make do with the hand you’ve been dealt instead of crying over cast ballots. Your blindly negative view of him isn’t getting anything done. Stop being entrenched and start being USEFUL.

I don’t know why some people simply started bitching about Obama on this thread, but regardless, I found the Olbermann spot quite touching (watch the video) … and I thank him for it.