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Loading ...McCain, Obama wary of gay marriage debate
09.22.2008 8:24am EDT
(New York City) Proposed bans on same-sex marriage are on the ballot in three important states this fall, rousing passions on both sides, yet neither John McCain nor Barack Obama seem eager to push the issue high on their campaign agendas.
In California, the stakes are particularly high - it’s the first time a ban-gay-marriage amendment goes before voters in a state where same-sex couples already have the right to wed. Similar amendments are on the ballots in Florida, a battleground in the presidential race, and Arizona, McCain’s home state.McCain supports the amendments, Obama opposes them - yet the two nominees rarely mention them proactively as they compete for middle-of-the-road voters who rank the marriage debate low on their list of concerns.
“It doesn’t benefit either one to promote it for their own campaign,” said Matthew Corrigan, a political science professor at the University of North Florida. “You have the economy, the war. It makes it more difficult for social issues to get people’s attention.”
Both presidential candidates say they oppose same-sex marriage, although Obama adds that his personal beliefs do not translate into support for banning it. And unlike McCain, Obama has declared his support for civil unions that grant marriage-like rights to gay and lesbian couples.
McCain, while asserting it’s an issue for states to decide, has endorsed the proposed bans on this year’s ballots and has not advocated for federal recognition of the various same-sex partnerships now legal in 10 states.
In the past, McCain has voted against a federal ban on same-sex marriages, but in this campaign he’s signaled he would back such a ban if federal judges sought to impose them on states that didn’t want them.
For partisans on both sides, there’s a degree of frustration that marriage isn’t more prominent in the campaign, coupled with an understanding that economic issues are taking precedence.
“We wish it were a top issue - it seems not to be,” said Tom Minnery, a senior vice president with the conservative Christian group Focus on the Family.
In Florida, where presidential campaigning will be intense, gay-rights activists hope Obama will not be too cautious in discussing the state’s ban-gay-marriage measure.
“We would like Sen. Obama to be much more emphatic in his opposition to Amendment 2. We’d like his campaign to acknowledge that in a stronger way,” said Stephen Gaskill, a spokesman for the Florida Democrat’s gay and lesbian caucus.
The spotlight on same-sex marriage will be brightest in California, where Proposition 8 would amend the state constitution to limit marriage to a man and a woman. If approved, it would overturn a California Supreme Court ruling that made the state only the second, after Massachusetts, to legalize same-sex marriage.
Statewide polls indicate the amendment will be defeated, but both sides are raising millions of dollars for a campaign they depict in epic terms. Opponents of same-sex marriage say California represents a last chance to block its spread; gay-rights activists say affirmation of it by voters in the largest state would be a watershed victory.
The president of the largest national gay-rights group, Joe Solmonese of the Human Rights Campaign, expressed hope that young voters - who are relatively supportive of same-sex marriage - will help defeat Amendment 8 while turning out in large numbers to back Obama.
Some conservatives see the possibility of a contrasting demographic trend in Florida, with churchgoing African-Americans turning out in huge numbers for Obama while casting votes for the ban-gay-marriage measure.
“We’re expecting black support,” said John Stemberger, who heads the campaign for the Florida amendment.
Florida is unusual among the states - requiring 60 percent support from voters for proposed constitutional amendments to be enacted.
“If the threshold were 50 percent, it would likely pass, but 60 percent is a very difficult scenario,” said David Johnson, former executive director of Florida’s Republican Party.
The Arizona campaign is noteworthy because in 2006 it became the only state to defeat a proposed ban on same-sex marriage. Similar measures have passed in 27 other states.
The Arizona measure failed two years ago in part because opponents contended it would jeopardize domestic partnerships and other arrangements benefiting unmarried couples. This year’s version has been streamlined to simply define marriage as between a man and woman; its prospects are considered strong.
Yet gay-rights activists insist that same-sex marriage and other “culture war” issues will be less effective for Republican candidates than in November 2004, when marriage amendments won approval in 11 states.
“No matter where you fall on the issue of marriage, people are seeing these divisive tactics for what they are,” Solmonese said
Solmonese said there is broad support for Obama among gays despite his hesitancy on same-sex marriage. In contrast to McCain, Obama supports other gay-rights priorities - extending job discrimination and hate-crimes laws to cover sexual orientation, and scrapping the “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy that bars gays from serving openly in the military.
John Marble of Stonewall Democrats, which represents the party’s gays and lesbians, said activists were encouraged that Obama was wrestling with how to extend federal recognition to same-sex couples.
“We’re not in total agreement with him, but at least he’s engaging in that conversation,” Marble said.
Marble and Solmonese said McCain was sending two sets of signals regarding same-sex couples - telling conservatives he firmly opposed gay marriage while suggesting to moderates that same-sex relationships were entitled to some sort of legal recognition. They said his choice of Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin as running mate reinforced his message to the religious right, which views her as a staunch opponent of same-sex marriage even though she hasn’t publicly raised the issue since her nomination.
“McCain has been quite skilled at wrapping up discriminatory views in a nice package,” Solmonese said. “I couldn’t tell you where his heart genuinely is.”
the marraige debate is too hot a potato for now. Best avoided by both candidates.
I give them that space as a voter. But I will not give space to any candidate supporting antigay marriage bans and constitutional amendments. I am fed up with having to donate to fights to fend off antigay marriage constitutional amendments.I supported the marriage fight in Massachusetts back then and getting ready to support the fight to save gay marriage in California. I will do what I got to do to defend gay marriage. But I don’t have endless funds to stave off amendments in many more states. Other gay men and women need to step forward to and reach into their pockets, wallets and purses and help out. It’s their future in this land as well as mine.
Like it or not, the economy is going to be the major issue this year. Not same-sex marriage or ‘activist’ judges. Not even the war in Iraq. Not net neutrality or Iran, or even the Israelis and the Palestinians. The economy.
The candidates each have a group of evangelical supporters, neither wants to offend. Sen. Obama is more liberal on this issue, but he still doesn’t want to lose that base. Sen. McCain, likewise, doesn’t want to lose that base either.
This matter will be settled in twenty years. It just won’t happen in the next four.
Obama to Launch Another Faith Tour That Includes Rabid Anti-gay Supporter of Prop. 8 Which Would Ban Marriage Equality for Same-sex Couples.
According to the major GLBT publication, the Advocate:
“Sen. Barack Obama’s campaign is reportedly launching a “Faith, Family, and Values Tour” next week in California that will include Catholic legal scholar Douglas Kmiec as one of the campaign’s surrogates.
Kmiec wrote an op-ed for the San Francisco Chronicle this summer in which he urged SUPPORT for passing California’s marriage ban, Proposition 8.”
http://www.advocate.com/exclusive_detail_ektid61930.asp#Receipt
(From the Sept. issue of the Advocate — Check it out!)
* * * * * * *
No wonder Mr. Two-face wasn’t at the HRC Pander Party last week. Obama was too busy schmoozing up to our most powerful enemies amongst the bible-bigots who are trying to overturn marriage equality in California. Obama’s new pal makes Fred Phelps look sane. And that’s a stretch.
Jeez, wake up and smell the blood pouring from the knife wounds in your own back people! Obama has no scruples at all.
If the old saying: “The enemy of my enemy is my friend” rings true, then the opposite is correct as well.
The friend of my enemy is my enemy.
When are the poor self-deluded, blind Lemming followers of Obama in the GLBT community going to see that they are being used and then herded toward the cliffs after the election? Hell, he is even doing it now under our very noses. Obama is telegraphing the evidence of his inner contempt and apathy towards us and our causes in his continuing revised statements of non-commitment, and in his vile acts of embracing known homophobes.
Where exactly do we rate when he allows a major proponent of an anti-gay constitutional amendment to go on tour with him? Does he denounce this hateful cretin? No, instead Obama embraces the same swine who is advocating the prohibition of the lawful marital relationships we have with the ones we love.
Further more, Obama nonchalantly says that he would “move slowly on DADT” and ask first for the consent of the same homophobes in the Pentagon and in Congress who gave us DADT in the first place, and he states very clearly “ don’t expect me to lead on it,“ he says.
He also says he would will not use the executive branch, the Justice Department, or even the Commission on Civil Rights to advocate for the repeal of DOMA or DADT. He is trying to tell us that in the unlikely event that something happens to further our rights in Washington, then fine…but don’t expect him to push for anything. Not even a little.
Yep, Obama is sooooo much better than a “do nothing for the gays “ McCain.
Hmmmm…
Believe me, a Democratic controlled Congress will do nothing for us as well if Obama does not make it a priority in his administration. For my part, I am not rewarding a hypocritical scumbag like this with my vote. This really is the last straw — he has lost my trust forever.
We should all be worried about a guy running for president who brings into the fold some of our worst enemies. Apparently, the gay community’s objection to the last “Obama Gospel Tour” which feature the “ex-homo” Donnie “Pray the Gay Away” McClurkin made very little impact on Obama and his campaign organizers. So now he brings on board one of the most outspoken and virulent supporters of the Anti-Marriage Equality Amendment in California.
Nice going Barrack! You came through for us once again!! At least Bill Clinton had the decency to wait to be a back-stabbing a-hole until after he got into office. I’m sort of glad that Obama is showing his true nature before the election. I once had to pick between a smooth-talking snake and decomposing rat on the dinner menu. Now Obama has made it easier to prefer none of the above.
But who really cares? The vast majority of Blacks will come out in Florida and in California and vote for Obama, and these very same “formerly oppressed people” and “Church of Hate” going Democrats will then vote to take our rights away. Yep, that’s the leadership we got from Barrack. That is what happens when some sweet-talking phony reaches out for the votes, and especially for money, from the Gay community, and then gives a wink and nod to those who want to destroy us. Can’t anyone see, he has sent a clear signal that it is ok for them to vote against us and to vote for him at the same time.
Some desperate Gay people are so scared of another Republican in the White House that you’d think there was a concentration camp and gas chambers waiting for them after the election. Just remember, “Slick” Willie Clinton (with the consent of the majority of Democrats in Congress) gave us DADT and DOMA. Ronald Reagan (swine that he was) appointed Anthony Kennedy to the US Supreme Court. Anthony Kennedy was the US Supreme Court Justice who wrote the landmark pro-gay majority opinions in Lawrence -v- Texas and in Romer -v- Evans. Liberal State Supreme Courts have rejected marriage equality in New York, New Jersey and in Washington, whereas a Republican Chief Justice of the California Supreme Court gave us marriage equality in California.
So nothing is as black and white as you think. I’m seeing a pattern here of Democrats proudly throwing Gays under the bus in order to prove that they are not as “liberal” as some might think they are. They appear to think that by doing so they might gain a few more “undecided” voters while still holding on to the pathetic “no where else to go“ Gay vote.
Just remember: Your alleged “friends” can sometimes be worst for you than those you think of as your enemies.
~ Bud Evans
* (my blog can be found by clicking on my name at the top of this comment)
Howzabout some gay (or pro-gay, at least) lawyers DONATING their time to fight this battle - PRO BONO!?!?!
There shouldn’t have to even BE a ‘debate’ - America ‘promises’ its citizens that they are ALL createed equal, that they ALL have the right to liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
Every time this issue hits the courts (even Republican-led courts), they admit that to deny us equal treatment before the law is UN-Constitutional.
And whatever happened to the Full Faith and Credit clause? If one is legally married in one State (or anywhere else, for that matter), then one is legally married.
hey Bud Evans..No one is saying Obama is GOD for the LGBT community..but WISE UP…OBAMA is definitely a BETTER choice for LGBT people hands-down. To vote for McCain is a vote to stagnate,or even lesson or lose any LGBT rights…I do NOT pretensd that this man is the Messiah..but he represent sbetter things for America in general and the world view of us.
Speaking strictly, from the presidential campaign point of view, just how important are these states? Arizona is McCain’s home state. California is solid blue. And increasingly GOP-dominated Florida doesn’t seem to factor much into Obama’s battle plans. The Obama camp seems to believe Virginia and Colorado are more likely to go their way than Florida.
No California is NOT solid blue. The larger metro areas of Los Angeles and San Francisco are that way, but the rest of the state by and large is right-wingers who vote republican.
Bud EVANS: I understand your anger; I’m angry too. But staying home on Election Day or throwing away your vote with a “protest” vote for some minor party candidate (and possibly throwing the election to McSenile and “Pow-Pow” Palin in the process) is not the way to go. Yes, Barack Obama isn’t the whole loaf; African-Americans in general don’t have the whole loaf yet in America; “I have a dream” was only 43(?) years ago; Stonewall was only in 1969. I’m 64 and in poor health; I won’t live to see the Promised Land, but I’m damned sure not going to hand the keys to the gates over to “an armed Anita Bryant” (thank you, Lisa Neff, for that EXCELLENT description of Miss Mooseburgers 1980)… the likelihood of McCain living through ONE term isn’t encouraging; two terms? No WAY! Look at the statistics for FOUR-time cancer survivors, never mind his age and the irreparable damage done to him in the “Hanoi Hilton.”
Cheers,
Bud Clark
San Diego CA USA
McCain wants to stay away from it because his Chief of Staff, Mark Buse, was just outed. Hypocritical piece of dung.
At least Obama has sat with the LGBT, and had discussions with our people. To Mr. Evans, so does that mean you are voting for “McCain, the same?”. He flip flops on everything, how can I put my trust in someone, who spews out anything to be liked. He’s just like a sprinkler, shooting alot of garbage out to the public. Obviously you are a “log cabin republican” who doesn’t want a black man to be in charge of our country. It’s very sad to have to listen to you guys,”log cabin’s”, go ahead vote for McCain, and you’ll set us back into the closets we’ve fought so hard to get out of.
Also, to the democrats that are scared of a “partially black candidate”, wake up!!!!…Our you going to let your fright vote republican, because he is an old white man?. I’ve experienced democrats saying that they will never live in a country run by a black president, and to put it gently that is true rascism and very closed minded. I will support my democratic party no matter what, and to me, although there hasn’t been much on gay issues, at least my candidate was open-minded enough to sit with a gay audience and listen to what they’ve had to say. period, I am done.
I just called Let’s Focus on SOME People’s ‘Families’ to inquire if they still support McCain even though he has an openly gay chief of staff. They, of course, declined to comment (no surprise). You, too, can call them toll free at 1-800-AFAMILY and express your ‘concerns’. I wonder how Mrs. Palin feels about this.
Nevermind that McCain isn’t talking about gay marriage with Obama.
Why isn’t 365Gay.com talking about McCain’s “closeted-until-today” (9-22-08) Chief of Staff,MARK BUSE!!!!!!!!!, Recipent of the “Roy Cohen Hypocrit” Award!!! Yes, Gay Folks, Yet Another Log Cabin Republican Closet Case! HOLY COW!
Hey Bud E,
Granted I am also pissed that Obama chose to have Prof Cammack campaign for him. However that is not a reason to throw the baby out with the bathwater.
Much more important than this - probably one of the most important issues this election cycle for LGBT people - is who the eventual winner will pick for the US Supreme Court.
There are 7 appointees named by Republican Presidents to the Court. Only 3 are reliable votes on issues of LGBT equality: Stevens, Souter and Kennedy. Scalia and Thomas will never vote for us, and Chief Justice Roberts and Alito, based on their conservative records to date, will also likely vote against us.
Both appointees named by Bill Clinton, Ginsberg and Breyer have and will always vote with us. That’s 100% for the Democratic appointees and what, less than 50% for the Rebublican appointeres.
We all know that the same gender marriage issue will eventually end up before the US Supreme Court. So I cannot sit out this election, and in essence give one more vote to McCain because Obama has done a few things that we do not completely agree upon.
I want Supreme Court appointees with judicial temprements similar to the Clinton appointees. On this alone, I am voting for Obama. I will not throw the dice and gamble that McCain will not choose appointees like Scalia or Roberts.
And, repealing DOMA, DADT, and enacting ENDA, and hate crimes legistation, may not be everything, but it is light years ahead of where we are now…especially for our LGBT brothers and sisters living in red cities and red states.
McCain has a gay chief of staff? What does Obama have? Ohhh, lots of gay money to provide empty promises!
Wake Up Sheeple. Obama’s gonna pat you on the back as he takes your hard fought rights away.
“Obama’s gonna pat you on the back as he takes your hard fought rights away.”
R-I-I-I-G-H-T, Trace. We believe yet more unfounded fear-mongering. W. got us so used to it, we’re just gonna ‘believe’ from now on.
It is McCain who is on record supporting anti-gay legislaton and encouraging States to do likewise.
Get a clue. You. Are. Not. Believed.