Comments on: Gay foes want Prop 8 donors kept secret

By: Hawk

Hawk — Mon, 12 Jan 2009 19:37:19 +0000

LOrion – They are not directly stating it NO, but it is the underline factor. It means that business that gave to support 8 their name would be hidden and we could not then boycott them for doing so. So they can still see the No to Prop 8 supporters and still boycott/etc to them, but take their names off so we can not do the same.

I take it you not been around lawyers and their practices much. I been working for lawyers for over 10 years now, you be surprised at what you learn and hear by just keeping eyes and ears open. Smoke and mirrors, thats what it basically is.

By: Mark

Mark — Mon, 12 Jan 2009 12:54:26 +0000

Hmmmmm…the AFA is launching a boycott of Pepsico based upon information obtained through dislosure laws, but Prop 8 supporters (aka AFA and ilk)don’t think it’s fair for us to boycott them on Prop 8.

Go figure.

By: Auntoys

Auntoys — Sun, 11 Jan 2009 13:41:49 +0000

Brendon:…excellent!

By: Gerald M. Callaio

Gerald M. Callaio — Sun, 11 Jan 2009 07:31:08 +0000

the “[punks'] can dish it out. But like all children, pun intented, cannot take it!!!!!!!!!

By: LOrion

LOrion — Sun, 11 Jan 2009 03:17:28 +0000

You guys need to blend blogs: This from Ruby-Sachs:

I am amazed by a story run by the AP today in which supporters of Proposition 8 are asking for court relief from campaign finance laws. One complaint is that business who employ people who donated to Prop 8 are facing boycotts.

Now I don’t believe that businesses should be held accountable for the political views of mere employees, but I also believe that boycotts are perfectly legal, important tools for the promotion of social causes. In fact, the anti-gay lobby has been, perhaps, the most successful boycotter of all.

They consistently encourage businesses (like McDonalds) to pull funding for equality organizations, encourage television networks to pull shows with gay content and encourage individual organizations to tone down their pro-rights language.

How can they be complaining about boycotts?

This case will not be about the right to a secret ballot. It is about the right to funnel large amounts of money to certain political causes. This, thank goodness, has never been a privilege in the United States.

By: Brendan

Brendan — Sat, 10 Jan 2009 22:21:18 +0000

On disclosure: I can’t believe that the proud winners of Prop 8 don’t want the world to know exactly where they stand and who their allies are! If they’re convinced that they are indeed protecting something precious from our GAY ability to destroy it, my goodness, you’d think they’d want their names on the front page of of every paper. Do they not view themselves as heroes? After all, they “saved” marriage in California! As someone who is directly affected by their wisdom, I want to know exactly who funded their efforts to save me from my unfathomable desire to settle down and get fair tax treatment. As a taxpayer that contributes to a political system that guarantees me this right, I want to know where the money comes from, as I feel it has adversely affected my pursuit of happiness. This is what we call transparency. It is part of our democracy. It helps avoid corruption, and is part of the fundamental checks and balances that guarantee the rule of law.
As for fear of retaliation: until they get beat to a pulp for being straight; until they lose a job for not being camp enough; until they have been denied the right to be with their loved one in a hospital because they don’t love each other in a religiously appropriate manner; until they have had the house they helped maintain and pay for stolen by holy, greedy, and marriage-protecting members of their partner’s family… Until they experience some good old fashioned American discrimination, I have no sympathy for their fears. They have no idea of the type of fear they instilled in me as a young man, and how much pain it caused. And now they claim THEY’RE victims? Heck, I just wanna know who paid so much money to save the sterling reputation of Californian marriage.
And on an even more alarming matter: Ron in Dallas: are you saying we’re a different race? Or are we a different ethnicity? A different culture, perhaps? You sound like a segregationist. I am as proud of being gay as I am of being left handed. I have no pride in things I did not accomplish. Being gay is just a sexual orientation, it is a scientific curiosity, it is what makes us an invisible minority (Canadian terminology – we might consider it in the US). But that’s it. To be proud of one’s gayness is silly. It’s like being proud of one’s hair color. Before I hear “self-hating homosexual”, I will admit that I am proud of my personal accomplishments. But the fact that I’m gay is not an accomplishment. It just is. And that’s just fine. You lament the loss of gay pride. You say I should be proud of the sex acts I engage in. Why? Nothing could be more superficial. Please don’t tell me that I’m so different that I have to act a certain way. I’ve lived and worked on 4 continents, sometimes in countries where being gay is illegal. I certainly don’t need a fellow American telling me how to act or what to be proud of. That is not the American way. I suggest you check out how gay people live in other parts of the world. You can do so online. But you might not like it: you’ll discover that we’re actually not all that special. Can you deal with not being special? I doubt you’d like it: you’ll no longer be in the limelight, darling. Unfortunately, equality neutralizes specialness. Equality means we can be proud of things we actually accomplish, not the rather dull fact that we’re an invisible sexual minority. If gay pride fell apart, Ron, it’s because it was based on feeble foundations. If folks like you could stop spending so much time being proud of what you do in bed, how you dress, or how “gay” you act, our “community” just might find REAL things that we can be proud of. Consider some facts: Like the fact that 10% more Californians voted FOR our rights than the last time around. Like the fact that we lost by less than 3%. Like the fact that the USA is doing more to fight AIDS in poor countries than any other nation. Gays can take REAL GAY PRIDE in these achievements – our activists made these things happen. People screaming that we’re so different that we might as well secede from the human race – and that sex acts are something that bestow pride upon a community – they do nothing for us. Go visit the world (online), Ron. It sounds to me like you want everything except equality in the eyes of the government or society. And your reasons seem quite selfish: you want special treatment, not equal treatment. You insist we’re naughty if we think marriage and kids are OK for some gay folks – just because its heteronormative. And you want me to be proud that I’m a scientific curiosity. Tell ya what, Ron. Go help a little old lady today, or go talk to a lonely friend. Then take pride in the fact that you did something useful with your day. Call it gay pride. But DO SOMETHING, and don’t tell me that screwing 19 guys between now and Monday is an accomplishment you take pride in – unless you are getting paid. Then, you can have professional pride. Not gay pride. We are more than what we do in bed and we are more than how differently we act from non-gay people (here’s a shocker: most people don’t know I’m gay unless I tell em!). How dare you attack the Mattachine society? Did you do more to advance justice during those days, Ron? Or are you just attacking a generation you know little about? Take your anger and put it on the back burner, because it’s apparently blinding you. Then get out your history books and learn a little about humanity. You’ll find plenty of things gay people can take pride in – and you’ll find that maybe you’re not really qualified to vilify most gay people just because they don’t live in your sheltered world where it’s safe to rant about how one must act and think in order to join your club.

By: Scott

Scott — Sat, 10 Jan 2009 18:21:27 +0000

“Hi, we’re the Prop 8 people, we want to deny gay people their rights, but we want our names to be kept secret. Thanks!” What a stupid argument.

By: Trace

Trace — Sat, 10 Jan 2009 16:51:29 +0000

We have not lost our way Rob in Dallas.

Some of us have always had the goal of getting married (to a same sex partner)and settling down. That does not make us any less fabulous.

Yes, I’ve had my wild days. I’ve had my party days. I remember a time when you entered into gay bars through discrete entries in the sides of buildings. I’ve slept with more guys than I can possibly even count.

But it speaks to how far we’ve come that couples are openly setting down. Openly adopting or having surrogate children.

I think that those that have been able to achieve this are even more “Fabulous” than we had ever been able to have imagined even back in the 80’s.

By: Ron in Dallas

Ron in Dallas — Sat, 10 Jan 2009 15:54:35 +0000

Sometimes I just cannot believe how far off the path the gay community has wandered. When I read articles and opinion columns in the gay press I sometimes forget it is the gay press. What have we become? I’ll tell you. Faux heterosexuals. Makes me sick. They talk about gay rights and equate that with marriage, a broken heterosexual institution. SICK! They talk about having kids and settling down in a nice house with a white picket fence. SICK! Let’s do the whole get married, buy house, have 2 ½ kids, dog…etc. Sound nice?

Don’t get me wrong. If that is truly your idea of happiness, more power to you. Just make sure it’s YOUR idea. Every since the Stonewall Riots there have been people like the Mattachine Society telling us to be like the heteros. We are just like them and we need to show it. We now follow gay rights organizations that espouse this same philosophy. BULLSHIT!! Let me be clear. WE ARE NOT LIKE THEM!

WE ARE FABULOUS! We are queer. We are men that suck cock and women that eat pussy and we should be damn proud of that. Did you get that word? PROUD? What happened to gay pride? Where did we loose our way? I’ll tell you. We sold our collective gay souls for acceptance. Acceptance by secular society, acceptance by the government, acceptance by organized religion. We have become a bunch of assimilationist fags that can barely be distinguished from any heterosexual on the street.

We need to remember those who have come before us and DIED for being fabulous and gay. We need to take back our gayness and tell those who would have us mimic heterosexuals WE WILL NOT! We will not be quieted, we will not be patient, and we will not assimilate. TRUE PRIDE IN 2009!!

By: JayC

JayC — Sat, 10 Jan 2009 15:22:35 +0000

Where did all that pride in their righteousness go? Free speech is legal; it’s naive to think it has no consequences.