Subscribe to Breaking NewsVanasco: Obama caving on Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell?
This is what I was worried about.
According to the Washington Times, Obama’s team is saying that even ASKING for a repeal of the ban on open gays in the military may not happen until 2010. First, he wants to build consensus.
Fair enough.
But it seems to me that consensus is already built – or at least as much as it’s going to be. Earlier this week, 104 retired generals and admirals called for DADT’s repeal.
A former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff spoke out against DADT in 2007. So did a former Secretary of Defense. 143 members of the House have co-sponsored a bill to overturn the policy; a bill approved by the House Committee on Armed Services.
We know the US military needs more soldiers to fight the two wars we are engaged in – last year alone, 627 servicemembers were dismissed under the DADT. The military needs servicemembers and gays want to serve.
You know what else? DADT is expensive. In February 2006, a University of California Blue Ribbon Commission concluded that so far, it has cost the government (meaning, us, the taxpayers) $363 million.
Don’t Ask is a failed policy. The only people who don’t think so are homophobes.
I understand what Obama is trying to do here. He’s trying to avoid a Clintonesque debacle like the one that gave us DADT in the first place.
But of everything we’re fighting for, DADT seems like it’s the least controversial and would make the most sense. If this isn’t even being looked at until 2010, then when is he going to start making good on his campaign promise of federal civil unions? When (if) he’s re-elected?
I’ve got a better idea. Why doesn’t Obama name a gay person – like Col. Margarethe Cammermeyer, say – as Secretary of Defense? That would signal real change – and give gays and lesbians real hope.
Barrack Obama is the most exciting candidate I have seen in my long life time, (I’m 56). I do not understand the tendency by some in our community to be anti-Obama before the man has even taken office. Bill Clinton failed on gay rights issues miserably not because he was anti gay but because he failed to build a consensus and to be honest we were dispensible. I firmly believe that Barrack Obama is committed to gay rights on a variety of levels. I also believe that it is time for the gay movement to grow up and learn how to play political ball.
No Mark, Gays and lesbians don’t need to “learn how to play political ball”. Politics is NOT a game sir, it’s not the super bowl or the world cup, we’re dealing with REAL issues effecting REAL people and the LAST damned think we need is to “learn how to play political ball”.
And as far as our need to “grow up” as you say. I say, it’s your generation who failed to make any substantial change, who need to kindly keep your opinions to yourselves, and step aside, so REAL progress can be made. If we were to “grow up” as you suggest, all the youthful energy and vibrancy that has finally injected itself into our movement would be lost, like a retiree in a convalescent home.
The days of Stonewall and the 70s are OVER, we need to move RAPIDLY into the next phase and we need to stop playing politics as usual as many on this site keep suggesting. Gay and lesbian rights transcend ideology, they transcend race, class and many other arbitrary barriers. As left wing as I am, I don’t want gay rights and marriage equality to become bogged down by partisanship or ideology. We need gay Dems, gay Republicans, gay Progressives, gay Socialists and countless others all on the same damn page. Obama, his administration and his re-election are NOT our concern, our concern as gay Americans should be gay and lesbian issues. We should be fighting for marriage equality NOT marrying ourselves to someone’s 4 year administration. We should be fighting for gay rights NOW, because while it may take time, as many have suggested, nothing will happen unless we are the change we seek. Gay and lesbian leaders who have preached gradualism for the past 2 decades need to step aside NOW, because y’all have done NOTHING but hold the community back. We need new energy, we need raw grassroots anger, we are moving away from the phase of dependency on HRC, NGLTF and other organizations and lobbyist groups. America has tired of lobbyists, we need people on the ground pushing for change NOW, or we’ll never see it in our lifetimes. It is a sickening shame that nations like South Africa, Spain and Nepal have marriage equality before the United States of America. Gay Americans need to embrace that most American of notions that drove our forefathers to declare independence in 1776, impatience for justice. Justice delayed is justice denied. How long?!?! How long must we wait until the promise of that most American of documents is fulfilled, HOW LONG?!?! How long must we wait until the waters of justice flow over us. HOW LONG!? We have been told again and again to take the tranquilizing drug of gradualism, not only by society as a whole but from our own “leaders” and where has it brought us. We will never have perfect political conditions for progress, we need to take every chance, every opportunity for progress and push NOW, or we’ll all be 56 and wondering why every country in the world except our own treats gays and lesbians as equal citizens. The time to act, the time to pressure, the time to fight for our rights and equality is NOW. There will never be a more perfect time but now. To shameless plagiarize MLK “Today is the day of salvation” “we must not ignore the urgency of NOW”.
Rodney Moore,
I have always favered full gay marriage over civil unions.
You ramble on and on like you have me all figured out and yet you are showing me that you haven’t got me pigeon-holed quite as neatly as you thought you had.
Good day, sir.
blacksteel, ya gotta come out of your fantasy land. Honestly, I don’t even think the ones that are calling Obama on the carpet are even Republicans. The people that have not drank from the Democrat trough are simply gay men and women that are sick of being pandered to and sold down the river.
How is it that some people are unable to see where this man is headed? He got what he wanted from us, our votes and now he’s positioning himself as a moderate which is the same as saying he’s for the status quo gay people are in currently.
Jim Said: November 21st, 2008 at 5:15 pm
But give the man some time. Rome wasn’t built in a day and all the damage done by “shrub” and his friends won’t be undone in a day either.
*****************
What break? He hasn’t even taken office and he’s already caving on our issues. Are you one of those people that doesn’t get out of a burning house unless its completely aflame.
David in Dallas Said: November 21st, 2008 at 5:48 pm
Let’s not be too selfish.
**********************************
Sarrellec Said: November 22nd, 2008 at 3:12 am
Let’s get some perspective here folks.
So gay guys won’t be able to have their arms legs and faces blown off for Madison Avenue.
Boo f*cking hoo.
Let’s get public works jobs going and tackle the changes to Reaganomics which have nearly destroyed us all in the last 20 years. Then of course, there’s getting off of oil.
Priorities, people!
**********************************
I just keep forgetting how soo selfish lesbian and gay people are for demanding to be treated like everyone else. I also keep forgetting how unurgent our rights and humanity are. After all, we lesbians and gays do not have partners, we do not have children to raise, we do not have families that we need to protect. Our daily lives and our families should be relegated to the far end of the bus. We do not in no way form an important part of the american fabric. I just wonder had we be talking about another minority group would the same people been so eager to throw them aside and deemed their rights as not deserving of priority?
**********************************
Art Carroll Said: November 21st, 2008 at 9:19 pm
Canada keeps looking better all the time.
**********************************
It always has Carrol, but how convenient of you to now notice it. Maybe you would have been better off taking notice of it before the election. Maybe that should have been Obama’s message to us lesbians and gays during the election: Vote for me and then move to Canada, because Canada is so much better for you. He would’ve prevented all the disillusioned and confused hearts.
Rodney Moore: “If we were to “grow up” as you suggest, all the youthful energy and vibrancy that has finally injected itself into our movement would be lost, like a retiree in a convalescent home.
– Good point: Fair enough.
Rodney Moore: “And as far as our need to “grow up” as you say. I say, it’s your generation who failed to make any substantial change, who need to kindly keep your opinions to yourselves, and step aside, so REAL progress can be made.”
– I am a 42 year old gay Canadian and I seem to recall something that ‘distracted’ us in the 1980s and 1990s … it was some kind of health issue (???)
No, I think some of the dissapointment in Obama is genuine. Though I find it somewhat premature and illogical. There’s plenty of time to assign blame if the next four years turn out to be a disaster. But we have to give it time to develop first.
Now, I’m not suggesting we shouldn’t have an agenda at all. Some fanatical Democratic Party loyalists are already trying to weasal their way out of doing anything for us before 2012. We need to hold those folks’ feet to the fire. On the other hand, we should maintain realistic benchmarks and expectations.
I think the grumbling has deeper ideological roots than just DADT though. Most of the sour grapes from the left comes from the younger anti-Clinton forces that control the internet and college campuses (Huffington Post, Young Democrats of America, DailyKos, the Progressive Caucus). Throwing a 1992 class reunion wasn’t exactly the “change” they had in mind. So, some of the more extremist elements within the LGBT community might be joining their comrades in arms because of that general move to the center. I, however, have no problems with giving the Clintonistas a second chance. It has been 16 years now. And I have to believe most of them are older and wiser than they were in the 1990s. I think Obama did the right thing by bringing in a seasoned and experienced cabinet rather than go with the netroots crowd.
This article is bizarre. Nothing is going to happen in a day and planning while building a consensus is paramount if we are going to get real change. We should all know that based on everything that has happened recently.
Tom, very good point from the 40 Year Old Bear in the Room.
It seems that some have forgotten that they really do no experience anything like older gays have had to deal with and to stand against. Every right that a young gay person enjoys was on the backs of someone that has come before them.
It’s sad that the “newer” gay folk have not learned or are not interested in their history.
If I were 365gay.com, I wouldn’t be in any rush to accept speculation from the Moonie rag about anything.
I have never really understood the concept of the “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” policy. Seems to me that Gay men and women would do their country proud and the reasoning behind the policy in the first place was based on pure conjecture and not any solid facts. Like anything else in society involving the Gay Community, so much has been misconstrued and passed on from generation to generation without any hard evidence or actual studies to prove otherwise. And too, it has not been of major importance to the general heterosexual society to seek out the right answers, why should they, when they have their churches and religious leaders indoctrinating their every move. Gay people just want to get along in life like everyone else, they need jobs, whether military or civilian, to feed and support themselves and their families, to clothe themselves and their families, to pay taxes not only for their benefit but for the benefit of all citizens. And if they so chose to serve and protect their country like their neighbour, what is so very wrong in that?
Trace said: “blacksteel, ya gotta come out of your fantasy land. Honestly, I don’t even think the ones that are calling Obama on the carpet are even Republicans. The people that have not drank from the Democrat trough are simply gay men and women that are sick of being pandered to and sold down the river.”
Trace, those are odd comments coming from you. First of all, you’ve been visiting this site long enough to know that the primary person I was referring to was a self-declared McCain/Palin supporter.
Secondly, I recall that you said you are a Libertarian, that you were released from a previous job because you are gay, and that in spite of that, you still don’t believe in anti-discrimination laws that would have protected you. I don’t think I’m the one who’s in fantasy land.
From Candace Gingrich: A Letter to My Brother Newt Gingrich
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/candace-gingrich/a-letter-to-my-brother-ne_b_145739.html
The Obama apologists are blind to reason. They will happily celebrate being segregated into a 2nd Class marriage status and lash out at those who would support equality and speak out against Obama’s plan of segregation. The Supreme Court of Connecticut ruled that Obama favors a discriminatory policy towards gay Americans. But I bet you some fools will try to convince you that the Supreme court is actually just a bunch of Repbulicans in disguise, it’s all a plot. Because how else can you explain their ruling? lol.
Obama justed wanted to get elected and told numerous lies in order to secure victory. What’s so sad is that so many people fell for his lies. I’m not saying McCain was a better choice, because he wasn’t. What I am saying is that it was disappointing to me that so many members of our communitity are pleased with Obama when in reality we should see him as the lesser of two evils. The next election, all Americans, gay and straight need to demand better candidates for such an important office.