Subscribe to Breaking NewsWithers: What’s next after Prop 8 week-end?
The question I’ve been asking all week-end is what now. After the Prop 8 protests this Saturday, where do we go from here? What’s next?
Wish I knew or even had a idea that would be interesting. I know what we need to stay away from. Any whiff of religious intolerance will destroy any civil rights argument made for gay marriage. There is no chasm between being respectful toward faith and asserting the right to civil marriage. That should be the base for anything going forward.
The other thing important in our next move is that the race genie is out of the bottle when it comes to sexuality. The willingness to blame black and brown voters for Proposition 8’s passage belied any vision of the “gay community.” Well a community that’s diverse.
Aside from those two small ideas, I’m still at a lost of what should follow. What do you think?
The writing in these blogs and news pieces are some of the most lazy, redundant, un-constructive, and insufficient pieces for a professional website.
Speaking about the willingless of the gay community to blame the black community was not news. Gay people were angry at the black community, but how much? Out of the millions of gay people across the nation, even a website like this idiotically concentrates on the few people who were bashing blacks (WTF? is this guilt driven or something?) instead of serving the millions that were there righteously to grasp our rights and equality.
ABSURD and WORTHLESS POST!
Instead of protesting and blocking freeway traffic, why don’t the people in California put their energy into gathering the signitures to put an a measure on the ballot that would repeal Proposition 8? As close as the results were, the outcome might be different in an off-year election. What people outside CA should do is raise serious money to support a repeal effort. Quit complaining about how much the Mormons raised. We should been more serious about our own fundraising efforts to stop Prop 8. Before we cast blame on this racial group or that church, we need to point the finger at ourselves and ask, “What did I personally do to try to stop Proposition 8, and should I have done more?”
As a gay European, I followed the Prop 8 saga very closely. The NO victory would have had a major influence throughout the world (we should not forget that the US have often been an example in terms of civil rights). I am afraid the YES victory might now have a negative impact where gains are relatively ‘weaker’ (Spain, South Africa) or in country where debate on marriage or unions was taking place (France, Italy, Australia).
What to do now should start by recognizing past mistakes. Frankly, I wonder why you ‘let’ the referendum take place. It was clear since the beginning that it was like stripping a group of citizens of their fundamental rights (as recognized by the Constitution, according to the Supreme Court). It was too risky. It was like if -several decades ago- we had asked men in a referendum if women had the right to vote or white people if black people had equal rights. We cannot do popular referenda on fundamental rights! You should have had major rallies at that time in order to prevent the referendum or even to boycott it.
I do believe that the whole issue is mainly generational. The struggle will be won in 5 or 10 years. Meanwhile, the only solution -in my humble opinion- is that you fight -NATION WIDE- for a CIVIL UNION with all federal rights. Let us know if and how we can help.
Please, do not take this as criticism. It is rather a sign of admiration and maybe of some envy (the healthy one) as in some of our countries we are so far behind you that our struggle is just to affirm our right to exist, let alone to marry!
I would like to thank you for your struggle. It is very important to all of us, outside the US!
With my all solidarity!
While I agree that we should not become religiously intolerant I am not against holding their feet to the fire. Focus on the Family spent nearly 1 million dollars on this campaign only to have to lay off employees due to shortages in budget. IF a church politicizes itself to achieve an agenda (as most do) then they should NOT be able to hide behind religious sovereignty and claim intolerance against religion. The Mormon Church, the right-wing religious grps and churchs that funded this vote should be held accountable as should every individual and company that donated because it was not based on a religious ideal but a political ideology; an ideology of division and hate. No religion should never be held accountable for what the zealots do.
Well, Whithers, you can always go back to criticizing Obama…
James, unfortunately my idea is to fight religion. I say unfortunately because many in our movement, like yourself and HRC, want to placate religion.
OUTSIDE of the marriage debate I had already made the defeat of religion in our society one of my main political goals. Religion is evil. It negates science and curtails free thought that has allowed us to flourish as a race.
We are not the first generation to struggle with the oppression of religion. In the 16th century we had the Rennaissance. I wonder if people think about that word..the rebirth..the rebirth of what? REASONED THINKING. Yes, the arts, humanity, but also humanism and reason. It was a direct movement AGAINST the church. Lorenzo D’Medici was likely athiest and certainly deist and a leader of this movement.
Then you have in the late 17th century and into the 18th century the French led enlightenment. Similar word…enlightenment from religion. Decartes (sorry for spelling) and many other famous french philosphers ascribed to this movement and it was an ATHEIST movement.
So I will not accept pleas to leave religion alone! Religion is an evil force in our society and equal marriage fight or not, I put it at the top of my list of political goals.
And I do so without apology. Many will say what about the “good” religions?….what about the UU’s or Anglicans or Presbytarians.
Well, my answer is they are simply fooling themselves, trying to deny the evils of religion and creating a watered down cult to be more “accepting” to the people who don’t accept outright bigotry and hate speak. As with other fringe elements, these groups are irrelevant to the global struggle against the religion. The true power is held by the authoritarian and hate mongering sects and they will pull it all down with them.
So that’s my idea, as unpopular as it might be. Ban religion.
Nice personal points Jim!
Dave W,
Keep us informed about your plan to ban religion, okay?
Sincerely,
James
bad press sabatoges the movement,good acts,and good deeds inhance it,maybe if a group of gays volunteered to help clean up some of the burned areas in california,it might bring some good press for the movement,if I lived there,I would help,
I’m courious to see what impact the Movie’Milk” will have on the movement,how many people will it unite
The first thing we should do is start referring to the results of Prop Measure 8 as a win for us. Yes, we lost the ballot measure, but in terms of the long range big picture, this was a HUGE victory. Less than ten years ago a similar measure in California passed by over a 20 point lead by those who were fighting against gay marriage. Now, even taking into account the slanted half-truths and lies our opponents tried to get the public to believe, there was still only a 4 point lead for them.
A 20 point margin against gay marriage shifting to a 4 point margin in less than a decade? That is ENORMOUS progress, a huge gain in support for gay marriage, and a whole sector of the public that the religious right has lost.
Yes, we have to keep pressing on legislators and hopefully the judicial system fall down on our side. But the struggle wouldn’t have been over even if we had won the ballot. It’s a long time from being over. But let’s take a moment to acknowledge the progress when it’s right in front of our faces.
I would say to those who oppose gay marriage, ‘Enjoy your superficial victory on November 4th. Because it’s not going to last. The tide has turned. You’ve lost. You just don’t know it yet.’
Shari, I beleive in Hope and am a Pollyanna at heart, but I think we need to see this as not as a victory but a wake up call for our movement and our community. Regardless of the margin, we lost and we have to admit that. However, we haven’t lost the entire “war”. We must reform and rebuild based on lessons learned and putting forth a progressive agenda for our community to win on. The protests this past weekend were not just about the anger over a vote but anger over the total lack of grassroots organization in our movement. Look how many people turned out in 5 days because of a social network instead of a form letter from a national organization. That act alone says a lot.
I think we should plan something BIG! We need straight friends as well to join but, something completely NATIONAL and something that would be a big easier to do perhaps a boycott or.. something should be dont.. I truly feel that this is on everyone’s consciousness and should be dealt with now..I know everyone is thinking this will just be forgotten in a week.. I personally do not have any ideas.. but, who ever does please offer it.
It’s a state issue. It’s a state issue. It’s a state issue. BUT. Barack Obama has as much as said that it’s entirely acceptable to put het marriage in privileged status, with churches allowed to dictate legalities to the state(s). Mr President, it’s called separate but equal. Maybe Condi Rice was willing to sell her soul, but there are millions of Americans who did not do same for the neo-cons. I’m not about to participate in validating the new President’s bigotry. I voted for him, but he’s more vulnerable on this issue than any other president in our history. You think the GOP hasn’t already seen this brewing?
We’ll see where California places civil rights in its own legal hierarchy. Allowing 8 to stand allows for repeal of ANYTHING California might do better than the Feds (air quality). Again, don’t think this is so limited, or that it’s over.
Marching, chanting and holding signs are respected and venerable means of protest, but I wonder if it’s the best we can do. This massive, diverse group of people, connected to each other through digital wires. We could do anything. Marches and boycotts are great, but aren’t they a little… last century?
Although I won’t go into the justice, or otherwise, of their cause, I think The Impact should take a look at what Anonymous has done to protest the Church of Scientology. Whatever you think of their methods or target, they managed one thing that we badly need: they made protests fun. Large numbers of people are fired up over prop 8 and the others, but that anger will fade as life gets back into its normal groove. To keep this momentum going, we should make protesting fun.
Here are some ideas around fun, visibility, flash-mob technology, and interacting with the intended audience face to face. They require little money or organisational prowess: you don’t need anyone’s permission to start a protest. Just do it.
Coming out. This is dead simple, you don’t need a big group or any signs, and you’ll probably reach more people per head than if you did a big march or sidewalk type protest. Agree to go where people gather, like a shopping mall. Don’t gather or meet up and move in one big clump, mix in with the shopper crowd. At the agreed time, start coming out to people. Go up to them, and say: “Hello madam, my name is Joe Bloggs, and I’m gay.” “Hello, we’re Adam and Steve and we’re married.” Shake their hand. Go to the next person. Introduce yourself to them. Don’t get drawn into a discussion. Don’t have a shouting match. If they get angry, just let them be. Keep it up for maybe 20 minutes or so. Have a meet up afterwards in a bar or something.
Kiss in. Similar, but a little more confrontational. The point of this is to expose as many eyeballs as possible to the horrifying sight of people kissing. Take a hint from psychology: the way to treat phobias is exposure to the object of fear. So treat the homophobia of your neighbours by exposing them to your love. Stick together for safety and support. Get a small group of couples and go to a shopping mall or some other place where children and parents go. Spread out. Don’t let on to what you’re doing, the surprise is half the fun. At the pre-agreed time, turn to each other, hug, kiss, and tell each other you love you. Don’t cross the line into lewd behaviour, just make it absolutely clear that you’re a couple. Bring some friends with cameras to get people’s reactions. Don’t let it last more than a minute. Leave. Put the results up on YouTube.
If you’re still angry at Mormons and you’re up for something a little more complicated, try some street theatre. Dress up as Mormons and walk the streets reminding people to behave (dress properly, walk properly, not hold hands unless they’re married, walk on the pavement, etc.) Move down the street, challenging people about their dress, their hair, their weight, whatever is even remotely improper or unusual about them. Don’t get drawn into discussions. If they answer your questions, ignore them. If they get angry, apologise and act all huffy that they’d dare to attack you when you’re only doing your civil duty to make sure everything is proper. Make your way towards some kind of landmark or square, and there, make a statement about how the Mormons idea of right and proper is now law, and what will they go after next, etc. Don’t make fun of Mormon religious teachings. Shooting fish in a barrel is too easy and will only invite backlash.
Street preachers. Anyone can stand at a street corner and preach the Gospel or whatever, right? So why don’t the gays stand on street corners and preach the gay? Make up a bogus religion that preaches the spiritual benefits of homosexuality (see Plato). Have a stooge show up if you gather a crowd so you can stage a conversion. Be visible. Be funny. Make people notice you’re there, and you’re gay, and the “recruitment” argument is redinculous.
For all these kinds of actions, you can prepare some fliers or cards, stating your position and the reason for your protest in a few bullet points, with reference to a website if you have one. You don’t have to explain everything, but people should know why you’re there. The haters would like nothing better than for all the queer people to go back home, do their jobs, and be invisible like usual. We can’t afford that anymore. Remind them we’re still here. Daily.
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