Subscribe to Breaking NewsWithers: What’s next after Prop 8 week-end?
The question I’ve been asking all week-end is what now. After the Prop 8 protests this Saturday, where do we go from here? What’s next?
Wish I knew or even had a idea that would be interesting. I know what we need to stay away from. Any whiff of religious intolerance will destroy any civil rights argument made for gay marriage. There is no chasm between being respectful toward faith and asserting the right to civil marriage. That should be the base for anything going forward.
The other thing important in our next move is that the race genie is out of the bottle when it comes to sexuality. The willingness to blame black and brown voters for Proposition 8’s passage belied any vision of the “gay community.” Well a community that’s diverse.
Aside from those two small ideas, I’m still at a lost of what should follow. What do you think?
Withers said: “Any whiff of religious intolerance will destroy any civil rights argument made for gay marriage. There is no chasm between being respectful toward faith and asserting the right to civil marriage.”
I partly agree with Withers. Any appearance of religious intolerance, real or not, will backfire with the American public. But I also agree with Ted that we need to promote an understanding that religious beliefs are nothing more than ideas. They are a matter of choice. As such, they should never be placed beyond criticism nor given any more respect than any other kind of idea.
There is, however, a politically safe solution. In today’s religion-saturated society, the most effective and safest way to criticize religious beliefs is to counter them with opposing religious beliefs. To do that, I suggest that the gay rights movement should make better use of our allies on the religious left.
We have a right to demonstrate. We have a right picket where the oppression stems from. And if that’s a church, then so be it. This is not a violent act.
There is a difference between religious expression and hate speech and political action. The KKK is deeply religious and I don’t hear anyone tolerating their garbage.
The Constitution is meant to protect individuals from the government and from other individuals. Everyone has a right to freedom of speech, and religious expression up to the point where it starts infringing upon the rights of others. That’s where the line is drawn. No one has the right to take another person’s rights away, by vote or otherwise.
A Million Queer March? We need to also get the media to cover any and all protests. They seem to pick and choose what they will televise.
This is going to take some massive fighting.
I DO believe,eventually,we will prevail!
You guys are blowing it bigtime. The raucous & vicious attacks against anyone who voted for prop 8 are causing others to calll you guys the “Gaykk”
I think there should be more rallies,but should take the same form as the the civil rights did in the the sixties,with the peaceful style marches,even using the same slogans,like ” we shall overcome:,and “I have a Dream”maybe more people would associate with the way gays are discriminated against
I think a little civil disobedience is in order.
On a day of our choosing, in the not-too-distant future, LGBT people and their allies should go to the offices of the clerk of courts in counties all across California, walk in and sit down. They should block access to these offices for those heterosexual couples wishing to get married.
Since Proposition 8 stripped same-sex couples of the basic right to marry the person of their choice, I think that this protest to deny those same rights to heterosexual couples, if just for one day, one hour, one moment is fitting and symbolic. They will feel the same disappointment, frustration and powerlessness we feel.
Of course, most of the people seeking marriage licenses will be in on it, so when the press asks how they feel, they’ll say they understand how it must feel to be denied the right to marry.
When the day is done and the jails are full, then we’ll have made our point.
I agree that the demonstrations must continue. They serve many purposes. They get us publicity by keeping us in the news. They are also a great way to stay connected to one another as we move forward in this struggle. I am from California, but believe me, we are all together now. I am sorry that we were not involved when this crap was being passed in all of the states. I apologize to my gay brothers and sisters for not standing with them and thank you all for standing with me.
Create several legal challenges to Prop 8. There are 4 but they make the same legal argument. There are several other avenues to go after. I am considering one for my partner and I under the Privileges and Immunities Clause.
We should start electing gay representatives to public office as often as possible by creating a lasting organization that uses the internet to raise money for the campaigns. We can use the grassroots for this purpose as well.
I am not sure why there are no protests at the courthouse. It would not be the first time peaceful protests were done at a Courthouse. The justices should see our faces.
There must be a way to coordinate the legal and political spearhead with the grassroots movement to become more impactful and long lasting.
Many many times groups have had to start over at square one. Get used to it. What I would suggest is that more more money be spent on monitoring church groups and hold their toes via lawsuits if needed to the fire.
Once that is done there need to be a group(s?) dedicated to electioneering the minorities.
Also spend a fair amount of money in courts ensuring that everything is done above board. INCLUDING wording of the proposition plainly so there is no mistake on how one votes (or not) for it.
One last thing….pray that the California Supreme Court justices who have this case overturn prop 8 soon.
I was one who used to think that just as long as a domestic partnership had all the same rights as marriage, it would be fine. But now, after being a domestic partner in California and married, I know there’s a world of difference! First of all, separate but equal is never equal. There will always be at least a few little laws, rights, aspects that slip through the cracks. Just one tiny example is, my husband and I just found out that we could get $45 off our car insurance, just for being married! The insurance company won’t do it for domestic partners. And you must cohabitate to be a domestic partner here in California. No such requirement for marriage. I suspect one could find example, after example given the time.
Next, the self esteem factor. Aren’t we good enough to get the same as everyone else? This takes it’s toll. And, believe me, when we told our friends and families that we were going to be Domestic Partners, nobody gave a hoot. But, years later when we told them we were going to get married, everyone jumped with excitement and approval and support. There’s a world of difference, and we shouldn’t ignore it or short change ourselves.
Claim the word! Publicly declare that we are married and will always claim to be such. Specifically we will make that claim on any official tax, employment, insurance, or other forms. If federal and state laws do not permit this, they should be disobeyed as all unjust laws should be.
Ken’s right: claim the word. Even if you don’t go for all-out civil disobedience with tax forms, etc., don’t hesitate to introduce yourselves as married. S/he is your wife/husband, not your “partner”. Have a marriage ceremony, not a “commitment” ceremony. Even if you don’t have a state license or the phrase “By the authority of the state of…” you can still be declared married.
“Legal Marriage” was originally was strictly a state function the church didn’t get involved with: they blessed unions, they didn’t act as agents of the state. So if the churches now want to claim the term then ANY religious belief (or none!) has an equal right to claim it.
If people get used to thinking of “Adam and Steve” as married, the Prop 8’s will become less of an issue. (But don’t stop fighting in other ways at the same time.)
Get your races right:
Brown = South Asian / Indian Subcontinent
Orange = Latino
Yellow = East (or SE) Asian
Those are damn good ideas Alan