Subscribe to Breaking NewsWithers: Prop 8 aftermath shows homophobia and racism
Years ago, when I was a freshly outed new young queer, I went to some gay male meeting in Houston, Texas. We had the standard half circle conversation (what to do if the bar scene wasn’t your thing, how to stay healthy in the age of AIDS/HIV, forming a community, blah, blah, blah). As the conversation lagged, a gentleman turned to me.
“James. Can I ask you a question? Why are black gays so queeny and funny? My two black gay male friends are hysterical and so queeny.”
No one has ever accused me of being Richard Pryor (femmy is another matter). I tried to answer his question with care. Black gay men came in all shapes, sizes, pointed to Marlon Riggs’ Tongues Untied that emphasized black gay individuality.
“Yeah, whatever. My two black gay friends are just so funny,” he repeated.
I never returned to the group.
I’m probably being unfair. He seemed to be a nice enough fellow; however, what irked me was that he wasn’t willing to let go of his vision. Black gay men were funny fems and that was that. Please note: Nothing against humor nor fem-dom. I just have a concern when groups are talked about in broad strokes.
Ever since Prop 8 was defeated last week, our comment section has been filled with that type of racial certitude. Some stood proudly in racist territory (the gentleman who suggested that gay business owners fire black workers needs to take a law course), others have driven on the “I live/work with Negroes and know how crazy they be” road.
Everyone here has suggested, rightfully of course, that homophobia in the black community needs to be talked about and defeated. No argument from me. But the past week has shown the flip side of that coin: Racism in the gay community requires the same vigorous conversation.
I agree that racism needs to be tackled everywhere. But last week no one voted to prevent the races from marrying; communities that have faced centuries of oppression voted to oppress the GLTB community.
We all need to reflect on what that says.
Mr. Withers, again, you have missed the point. The sad thing is you are trying to make this horrible loss into a civil rights issue for your ethnicity group, while we are fighting for our civil rights as a different group. This is the second post you’ve made on the same subject…move on!
Your aquaintence in TX was a bigot. He was trying to say “all you blacks are funny and queeny and lower than me”. He just asked, didn’t say, but we know what he really meant.
In CA they voted, and we have the RESULTS. So, no, all blacks of course are not funny and queeny, but 70% of them voted for the ammendment. (or I guess the female population, for some reason I haven’t seen how the guys voted.)
hmmmm….perhaps what we are saying is true, and is not racism.
Pointless argument, however. Let’s just work against religion and all Americans, black, white, brown…will benefit.
Just don’t paint me with the same brush as your bigoted aquaintance in TX. We are not espousing opinion to cover up discomfort, we are dismayed at how they voted.
Racism is, indeed, a problem. But I wouldn’t expect a white person from rural parts of California to understand the fight for equality. I wouldn’t expect a fundmentalist religious person whose mind has been poisoned by images of a hateful God. I *would*, however, expect a minority–blacks–to understand, and not vote to strip away equal rights. And here, Mr. Withers, they did not.
Shame on everyone who voted against equality from the whitest white Mormon to the blackest black Angelino.
Dave Wimberly:
Actually it’s you that have missed his point. He did not ignore that there is homophobia in the Black community. He called out the racist comments made during this debate.
It amazes me that so many here want to trivialize that part of the issue.
As I’ve been saying, the racism in the Gay community may have bitten us in the a$$ this time.
I agree that some of the comments have been racist and over the top, but merely remarking about the disproportionately high percentage of blacks, compared to other ethnic groups, that voted in favor of Prop 8 is not racist. Racism entails drawing unfair and unfounded generalizations that are inaccurate and not based on fact. The generalization that most blacks who voted in California voted in favor of Prop 8 is based on the exit polls, not unfair and prejudiced assumptions. Acknowledging this racial disparity on the Prop 8 issue is the first step towards working to do something about it. Certainly, no one is saying that all blacks are against gay marriage, because 30% voted to defeat Prop 8, and celebrities like Whoppi Goldberg and Samuel L. Jackson publicly spoke about how wrong it was. Nonetheless, clearly there is work we need to do in the black community.
As a white gay man who grew up in New Orleans, a majority black city for most of my life, I have to confess my ignorance of what it must be like to be black and gay.
Like many I left for a larger city to find my own freedom. In Manhattan, I met black men, probably not-gay identified, whose voices and body language changed enormously depending on whether they were in a gay environment or a straight one.
The experience left me with an awareness of my own ignorance and a feeling of sympathy for the burden their behavior reflected.
I have met gay-identified black men and appreciate the fact that they have been approachable.
It doesn’t surprise me that someone could be shallow enough to make up a simple-minded stereotype about gay black men, but it does disappoint me.
Yes, racism exists in some and homophobia in others, but I find Wither’s vision deeply troubling if he wants to take this moment to remind us of the prevalence of racial predjudice.
We are talking about civil rights here, and the use of the vote to rescind them. This is a bit more than a troubling racist/homphobic remark, and like it or not, Prop 8 pulled minority hate out of the closet, and the Prop 8 results are NOT new. We have seen this trend before.
Since we’re sharing anecdotes, as a gay white male who lives in a large New England city, my partner and/or I cannot go six months without some racial/ethnic minority members calling us a fag, maricon, or whatever, so let’s not overweight one type of telling for the other.
Lastly, I am dissappointed by your lack of resolve Withers. You write, “I never went back.” I find this sad, for if I ran out of everyplace where I encountered homophobia, I would have hardly ever had a job or a social space. Plus, things don’t change when you run from what needs to be changed. Maybe drop some of the victimology and learn how to be a bit more fierce with your individuality.
Well, since the gay community voted (and supported) overwhelmingly for a black presidential candidate, how can you dare call gays racist? If gays were really racist they would have voted against the black candidate not for him. Give me a break, blacks have more of a problem with gays than do gays have a problem with blacks. It’s not racist to call blacks (the majority of them, at least) homophobic. I think the real point being made by gays is that blacks (of all people) should be able to recognize injustices whether those injustices are against them or against other groups of people. The fact that 70% of CA blacks did not see same-sex marriage as a matter of equality says that they should be criticized for their prop. 8 votes and the larger issue of homophobia (and heterosexism) in the AA community. And frankly, Withers I think you were unfair to that guy at that meeting to asked that question. Yes it was a dumb question, but don’t go characterizing the larger gay community based on one idiotic question.
I agree. That is one of the reasons why I had a hard time reading some of the comments last week.
James, this is an interesting interview from Rachel Maddow with the Political Science Professor at Princeton about the cultural issues behind Prop 8. It gets to the heart of the racial aspect of this issue. She said that while the “No on 8” campaign could have had a better outreach to communities of color, and should have highlighted the similarities between our historic struggle; but she also said “..on the other hand, communities of color demonstrated an awfully bigoted vote”.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcZVAlSqNbA
What support mechanisms exist for the African & Latino-American GLBT community?
It seems to me that there in lies the biggest challenge. That’s where the battle for owning our perceptions exist.
Passionate comments.
Please, let’s not get lost in the rhetoric of frustration. We are a community – diverse and rich.
There’s a lot of energy here – focus on what can be done to make change. What can you do to help bring about change?
Once again Mr. Withers is on the wrong side. Once again, it is the oppressed that he seems to think are causing the oppression. Isn’t that really what is being said – that we are the problem?
Last week we all felt the palpable anger, sadness, and bigotry displayed against us int he CA vote. As a community, many were trying to understand just HOW this could happen – did it go to far? When our community has stood with soooo many other communities for decades fighting for THEIR equality…many of us just assummed they would understand the struggle and wouldn’t inflict the same descrimination on us that they had on them. So YES many lashed out – some went a little too far but deep down, I think it was out of anger at seeing a 70/30 margin in the black community against us after all we’ve done for them and that at the end of the day, our community as a whole is not racist and wants equality for all.
What we should really do now is stay angry but direct that anger appropriately, not in a bigoted fashion but back to the streets as we are seeing in CA but need to do on a national level. Continue to protest. Continue to fight the Mormon church and any other church that provides financing for elections. Continue to push Separation of Church and State. Demand that our new president elect actually take up the mantle of equality for all and hold him and the new congress accountable for ALL citizens. But to do this, we have to stay angry and stay motivated to keep on top of this. Continue to be engaged and not just let this die out as we have done so many times in the past.
Without intending to ignore homophobia among blacks, I agree with Withers about the many recent comments on this site that express or promote racial prejudice and that ignore the significant portion of blacks who support us.
However, there is also a suspiciously disproportionate pattern in the comments. It should be considered seriously that some visitors to this site are intentionally and in an organized fashion trying to create division within the gay community for the benefit of the political and religious right. This is not surprising. After all, 27% of gays voted for McCain/Palin, even though the duo was clearly opposed to gays on virtually all gay rights issues. And, even now, Repub gays can’t seem to get over the fact that their team lost and continue to promote resentment against Obama and the Dems within the gay community.
(It would be interesting to know how many of those same gays voted against the community on the anti-gay state propositions, even as they try to demonize Obama for not being more supportive.)
Actually, what we have seen after Prop 8 is religious bigotry by homosexual activists.